Celtic Heroes

The Official Forum for Celtic Heroes, the 3D MMORPG for iOS and Android Devices

Against the dominance

#1
Hi,

In our server (I don't know if i can mention wich server) dominance is causing allot of people to leave the server, don't play anymore or join the dominant clan, since the game gets boring. The dominant clan here doesn't cooperate with any people outside there clan. Here we lock most likely bosses by lock, But the ratio might be 1/15.

My question is how are servers fighting against the dominance?

And if a dev or anyone else of the creator of the game sees this, could you add new lvl 190 and 220 gear out of shop, mobs, or even fishing?!

Or add an in-game solo play area with bosses that you can solo kill that might drop good stuff?

Bye

Re: Against the dominance

#2
isolatie wrote:Hi,

In our server (I don't know if i can mention wich server) dominance is causing allot of people to leave the server, don't play anymore or join the dominant clan, since the game gets boring. The dominant clan here doesn't cooperate with any people outside there clan. Here we lock most likely bosses by lock, But the ratio might be 1/15.

My question is how are servers fighting against the dominance?

And if a dev or anyone else of the creator of the game sees this, could you add new lvl 190 and 220 gear out of shop, mobs, or even fishing?!

Or add an in-game solo play area with bosses that you can solo kill that might drop good stuff?

Bye

Keep at it, no clan is born with dominance.
Warrior 222, Ranger 220,
Concordiia,
Donn.
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Re: Against the dominance

#3
How to break a dominant clan 101:

1) Talk in private to a select few of people to see how they feel about their clan. Do they like the distribution system? Do they like their leaders? Which leaders do they not like and why? Do they wish they could do something different?

2) Approach the leaders you feel are most open minded. Ask them these same questions in number 1.

3) If you can gather at least 20% of the clan is interested in change or fails to trust their leaders, then you have what can be the militia to start your revolution.

4) Start out by suggesting new, probably unsatisfactory ideas in an attempt to illicit messages from leaders resembling a form of dictatorship. Use these to message players that you think this leader is unfit to hold their position.

5) Attempt suggesting radical changes. Do your clan members control what happens in the clan? Why not suggest to give them the power to vote on new leaders? The more distrust in one particular leader the more likely people will agree and want to be able to vote that leader out. Others will also like to have their voice matter, but might be too afraid to stir the pot. Therefore you should offer secret polls where votes can be counted and no names will appear.

6) Suggest a radical change in the direction you actually want to change to. Explain how it will benefit the server and provide growth to it. This will be the toughest challenge, but the more outspoken people will tend to lead the charge from here.

7) Keep picking at certain players you want to break down and get them to show their ugly side. The uglier they get the more the other players will not want to be around them and tend to agree more with your line of thought. Revolutionizing a server can take months to a year. But with the right patience, tact, and an accumulation of dirty behavior you can get any clan to break apart.

Re: Against the dominance

#4
Rikitt wrote:How to break a dominant clan 101:

1) Talk in private to a select few of people to see how they feel about their clan. Do they like the distribution system? Do they like their leaders? Which leaders do they not like and why? Do they wish they could do something different?

2) Approach the leaders you feel are most open minded. Ask them these same questions in number 1.

3) If you can gather at least 20% of the clan is interested in change or fails to trust their leaders, then you have what can be the militia to start your revolution.

4) Start out by suggesting new, probably unsatisfactory ideas in an attempt to illicit messages from leaders resembling a form of dictatorship. Use these to message players that you think this leader is unfit to hold their position.

5) Attempt suggesting radical changes. Do your clan members control what happens in the clan? Why not suggest to give them the power to vote on new leaders? The more distrust in one particular leader the more likely people will agree and want to be able to vote that leader out. Others will also like to have their voice matter, but might be too afraid to stir the pot. Therefore you should offer secret polls where votes can be counted and no names will appear.

6) Suggest a radical change in the direction you actually want to change to. Explain how it will benefit the server and provide growth to it. This will be the toughest challenge, but the more outspoken people will tend to lead the charge from here.

7) Keep picking at certain players you want to break down and get them to show their ugly side. The uglier they get the more the other players will not want to be around them and tend to agree more with your line of thought. Revolutionizing a server can take months to a year. But with the right patience, tact, and an accumulation of dirty behavior you can get any clan to break apart.

This sounds like you're trying to break up and destroy the dom clan. Why not just gather like-minded people from outside that clan and fight against them? Keep growing your numbers and showing up to boss fights and offer some healthy competition. Maybe some players from that dom clan aren't happy and will even join you. I see no reason to "Keep picking at certain players you want to break down and get them to show their ugly side." That's a waste of time and can backfire on you.

Re: Against the dominance

#5
rameyrat wrote:This sounds like you're trying to break up and destroy the dom clan. Why not just gather like-minded people from outside that clan and fight against them? Keep growing your numbers and showing up to boss fights and offer some healthy competition. Maybe some players from that dom clan aren't happy and will even join you. I see no reason to "Keep picking at certain players you want to break down and get them to show their ugly side." That's a waste of time and can backfire on you.


That's exactly the point to break it up. You can obviously go the other direction you explained, but it's a much larger uphill battle and you essentially exile yourself from resources and gear for a long period of time. In this case, it does not look like the OP stands much of a chance starting from scratch outside of the system if the dominant clan wins 14/15 lock battles on average.

Re: Against the dominance

#6
If you fight against dominance and somehow win you’ll just cause even more players to quit or leave the server. You’re not going to win unless the dom clan falls to the ground via internal problems. Almost every dom clan has a very strong foundation so if you’re hoping to over throw them then get ready for a long fight. Yes there are stories about second clans topping dom clans, but it is a very rare occurrence and let’s face it... more clans crumble to the ground themselves than actually beating the dom clan.

Just play on a server like Epona or go somewhere better before you disappoint yourself
Zkills level 111 warrior, Proud general/last active member of the beloved KodiakReavers of Belenus.

Zkills, new mage of Epona, chieftain of KodiakReavers

Can you do the impossible?
Celtic Heroes Ultimate Challenge

Re: Against the dominance

#7
Zkills wrote:If you fight against dominance and somehow win you’ll just cause even more players to quit or leave the server. You’re not going to win unless the dom clan falls to the ground via internal problems. Almost every dom clan has a very strong foundation so if you’re hoping to over throw them then get ready for a long fight. Yes there are stories about second clans topping dom clans, but it is a very rare occurrence and let’s face it... more clans crumble to the ground themselves than actually beating the dom clan.

Just play on a server like Epona or go somewhere better before you disappoint yourself

It's not about trying to take over the server, and I don't think the OP intends to do that either (sorry if I'm wrong in that assumption). It's about having competition on the server instead of there being just one dom clan.

It's not impossible....we've done it before. But people get tired of the constant lock battles and quit - happened even as we were winning plenty of those locks. Normal and expected result of battling against a stronger, way better geared clan. You just need to find enough people mentally strong enough to stick it out until you gather enough people to actually BE competition to that dom clan. Until you get to that point, you will lose a ton of lock battles.

I wouldn't want to take over the server. I've been in the dom clan and it's pretty boring - killing everything all the time with little to no comp = boredom. That's why I left recently. I prefer to be on the other side of those lock battles.

I personally wouldn't want to play on Epona where the only competition is who gets the higher number in a rolling contest. No thanks.

Re: Against the dominance

#9
Rikitt wrote:How to break a dominant clan 101:

1) Talk in private to a select few of people to see how they feel about their clan. Do they like the distribution system? Do they like their leaders? Which leaders do they not like and why? Do they wish they could do something different?

2) Approach the leaders you feel are most open minded. Ask them these same questions in number 1.

3) If you can gather at least 20% of the clan is interested in change or fails to trust their leaders, then you have what can be the militia to start your revolution.

4) Start out by suggesting new, probably unsatisfactory ideas in an attempt to illicit messages from leaders resembling a form of dictatorship. Use these to message players that you think this leader is unfit to hold their position.

5) Attempt suggesting radical changes. Do your clan members control what happens in the clan? Why not suggest to give them the power to vote on new leaders? The more distrust in one particular leader the more likely people will agree and want to be able to vote that leader out. Others will also like to have their voice matter, but might be too afraid to stir the pot. Therefore you should offer secret polls where votes can be counted and no names will appear.

6) Suggest a radical change in the direction you actually want to change to. Explain how it will benefit the server and provide growth to it. This will be the toughest challenge, but the more outspoken people will tend to lead the charge from here.

7) Keep picking at certain players you want to break down and get them to show their ugly side. The uglier they get the more the other players will not want to be around them and tend to agree more with your line of thought. Revolutionizing a server can take months to a year. But with the right patience, tact, and an accumulation of dirty behavior you can get any clan to break apart.


So you are advocating actual deception, maliciousness, manipulation, and being an all around bad human to attempt to unseat a dom clan?

This is the behavior of a sociopath. And any dom clan that has been around a while has had to deal with your type before.
Clan Relentless
Praetorian V - 220 Warrior
PocketHeals - 220 Druid
Lucerin - 221 Ranger
The Bazaar - Trader

Re: Against the dominance

#10
I've given this so much thought over the past few years while watching the monopoly clan destroy our server. I believe the game was originally intended to have competition between clans at all levels...even the highest end game bosses.

Unfortunately some of the decisions about game mechanics and drop rates etc allowed clans to become monopolies. They had an easy time keeping that position because once they had enough people with high level gear, all they had to do was prevent everyone new from being able to acquire full armour or weapons. That meant competition was fighting with no aura and inferior, lower level weapons. They started this on frozen level and kept the final frozen armour boss and weapons bosses a priority so they got almost all those drops. Same thing with dl and edl weapons. This made them the only game in town for anyone joining the server or tired of trying in vain to get enough drops to gear their smaller clans. Many of those people would give up and join them so they were able to play the end half of the game.

OTM bumping frozen bosses made a big difference. That enabled smaller clans to finally get everyone in frozen armour and weapons. Same with dl. It's a bit longer and harder, and getting dl weapons still takes a long long time and a lot of work, but slowly smaller clans have been able to get people full dl.

Someone mentioned elsewhere the idea of limiting the number of people in a clan to try to combat the problem of a dominant clans and the negative impact they have on the game overall. I imagine dom clans would just create smaller tribes of the same clan and continue as they always have. Occasionally friction that caused might make a faction leave, but I think that way of fixing the problem would take too long if it worked at all.

I think the single best easy thing VR could do to combat the problems caused by dominant clans is bump all edl drops in this way...all 4*s drop a lex, all 5*s drop 2 drops, and 6*s have 2 drops with one being a guaranteed arcane. For 210 and 215 they only drop weapons lexs.

They would still have to win the lock, and with the dom clan still better geared and the color drop system it would still take a long time and lots of effort, but it would be more possible for smaller clans to eventually get edl armour and weapons on all their players. That would enable them to compete better, and eventually have a chance to be seen as a growing viable alternative to the dom clan for players who are willing to work to get there.

On our server more and more people are leaving because they are tired of being blocked from end game unless they join the monopoly clan. Many continue to stop playing from the dom clan as well because it's boring to never have competition and just kill the same bosses over and over. This monopoly system where players block other players from half the game unless you agree to play by their rules and let them be in charge is killing the game. VR needs to do something to change this before more and more people leave and servers die. There are lots of ways the game could be changed to fix the problems monopoly clans create, but the idea above is the easiest for VR to implement immediately and most unobtrusive non-controlling way I thought of so far. What are your ideas?

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