Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#11I'd rather ban due to the fact that I was not invited for this meal.
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#13Ah, I didn't know Keri was a Bambi killer!!!! That puts a whole new perspective on this......if Bambi can be so wantonly destroyed by this woman then it means she will stop at nothing and the Friendly Puppy will be next! I vote that she is immediately banned for all eternity! 
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#14Mmmm tender tasty Bambi.....shall I add that to the recipe thread?
In all seriousness, i do still need to cook up the rabbit I slaughtered not too long ago. Will be headed over to my bunny-farmer friend's house soon for another batch. Hopefully will have rabbit recipes to add to the thread. Can't decide whether to go slowly stewed with wine, bacon, onions, mushrooms and thyme sort of coq au vin style (lapin au vin?) or go with a tarragon-mustard cream sauce....
In all seriousness, i do still need to cook up the rabbit I slaughtered not too long ago. Will be headed over to my bunny-farmer friend's house soon for another batch. Hopefully will have rabbit recipes to add to the thread. Can't decide whether to go slowly stewed with wine, bacon, onions, mushrooms and thyme sort of coq au vin style (lapin au vin?) or go with a tarragon-mustard cream sauce....
Proud AvaloNian
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#16Wth. She also killed Thumper!!
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#17Not one, but many Thumpers it would seem! And all this talk of Coq Au Vin.......it would appear that even the male 'member' is not safe from her now alarming culinary tastes!!!!
On a more serious note, am not sure I could kill bunnies I had raised, or ducks etc, which means I am a complete hypocrite cos I love eating meat. In the old days village butchers would often slaughter small amounts of lamb, pigs and the odd steer themselves. It became banned in the 1990s I think due to EEC regulations. I once spent an entire day in the old cobbled back courtyard of such a village butcher, the last of his generation to be allowed to slaughter meat in this way. He wore a flat, leather hat and long, matching apron. He had an assortment of very sharp looking knives, also a long, metal steel (for sharpening his knives) laid out on a metal bench. He didn't speak much, but made it very clear I must stand well out of his way. He had already dispatched a large Steer, and I recall its muscly, decapitated head lying on the ground, both eyes wide open. He proceeded to slaughter a small pen of lambs and they were very pliable, allowing him to turn them on their backs, their legs in the air like thin, woolly posts. He then put a large bolt gun to their heads to kill them. It really was instantaneous and I had no sense at all of these animals suffering some gruesome death. But when it came to the pigs, it was a different story. They had been making high pitched squeals from the pen they were in, and seemed agitated. Each pig had to be dragged rather than lead out but at least he then very quickly killed them with the bolt gun. Apparently they are intelligent creatures and I certainly felt they knew something awful was about to happen to them. In my youthful ignorance I had never thought about the thick bristles on pig skin. After death, each animal's throat was swiftly slit to drain the body of blood fast. They were then attached by their back trotters to sturdy chains and hoisted into a massive barrel of boiling water. After being dunked, he then hoisted the pig out and with one of his knives he then easily scraped the now loosened bristles from the skin. I remember him turning to me, smiling and saying, 'So now you know lad why crackling isn't hairy!'.
The courtyard surface was not entirely flat, but rather had a very gentle incline towards a large drain in the centre and four stone gutters at each quarter of its whole. This was so the blood from slaughtering was quickly disposed of. At the end of the day, blood that had escaped the gutters and remained on the cobbled stones was easily brushed to that centre drain (helped by buckets of disinfected water being sloshed on the ground). That was the only time the slaughter man/butcher allowed me to assist him. I have to say the guy was an absolute professional and nothing he did in anyway made me question the process of animal slaughter. I had watched him slit the bellies of pigs and sheep right open, seen their bowels and stomachs swiftly removed and put into a large metal container (I think these inedible parts, along with organs like lungs and hearts were sold on for dog and cat food back then). Every organ was removed with great swiftness and such skill.
When I got home in the early evening I had my usual healthy appetite. When you actually see something like this I think it is far more acceptable than when you imagine it. At the end of the day, none of those animals would have had life at all if they had not been reared for human consumption. Cruelty towards reared animals is something else again (battery hens, and pigs kept in tiny metal or concrete pens), but at least these have improved now (it is now illegal to raise chickens in that environment anymore and I think pigs too). It doesn't mean that some small farmers don't break the laws and animal cruelty doesn't exist, but the majority of livestock in this country are kept in good and clean environments and ones where they can walk about!
I think I would be fine as a farmer, breeding and buying livestock which ultimately would be slaughtered. But if I personally raised a very few pigs etc I think I would become too fond of them and it would then be impossible to slaughter them.
On a more serious note, am not sure I could kill bunnies I had raised, or ducks etc, which means I am a complete hypocrite cos I love eating meat. In the old days village butchers would often slaughter small amounts of lamb, pigs and the odd steer themselves. It became banned in the 1990s I think due to EEC regulations. I once spent an entire day in the old cobbled back courtyard of such a village butcher, the last of his generation to be allowed to slaughter meat in this way. He wore a flat, leather hat and long, matching apron. He had an assortment of very sharp looking knives, also a long, metal steel (for sharpening his knives) laid out on a metal bench. He didn't speak much, but made it very clear I must stand well out of his way. He had already dispatched a large Steer, and I recall its muscly, decapitated head lying on the ground, both eyes wide open. He proceeded to slaughter a small pen of lambs and they were very pliable, allowing him to turn them on their backs, their legs in the air like thin, woolly posts. He then put a large bolt gun to their heads to kill them. It really was instantaneous and I had no sense at all of these animals suffering some gruesome death. But when it came to the pigs, it was a different story. They had been making high pitched squeals from the pen they were in, and seemed agitated. Each pig had to be dragged rather than lead out but at least he then very quickly killed them with the bolt gun. Apparently they are intelligent creatures and I certainly felt they knew something awful was about to happen to them. In my youthful ignorance I had never thought about the thick bristles on pig skin. After death, each animal's throat was swiftly slit to drain the body of blood fast. They were then attached by their back trotters to sturdy chains and hoisted into a massive barrel of boiling water. After being dunked, he then hoisted the pig out and with one of his knives he then easily scraped the now loosened bristles from the skin. I remember him turning to me, smiling and saying, 'So now you know lad why crackling isn't hairy!'.
The courtyard surface was not entirely flat, but rather had a very gentle incline towards a large drain in the centre and four stone gutters at each quarter of its whole. This was so the blood from slaughtering was quickly disposed of. At the end of the day, blood that had escaped the gutters and remained on the cobbled stones was easily brushed to that centre drain (helped by buckets of disinfected water being sloshed on the ground). That was the only time the slaughter man/butcher allowed me to assist him. I have to say the guy was an absolute professional and nothing he did in anyway made me question the process of animal slaughter. I had watched him slit the bellies of pigs and sheep right open, seen their bowels and stomachs swiftly removed and put into a large metal container (I think these inedible parts, along with organs like lungs and hearts were sold on for dog and cat food back then). Every organ was removed with great swiftness and such skill.
When I got home in the early evening I had my usual healthy appetite. When you actually see something like this I think it is far more acceptable than when you imagine it. At the end of the day, none of those animals would have had life at all if they had not been reared for human consumption. Cruelty towards reared animals is something else again (battery hens, and pigs kept in tiny metal or concrete pens), but at least these have improved now (it is now illegal to raise chickens in that environment anymore and I think pigs too). It doesn't mean that some small farmers don't break the laws and animal cruelty doesn't exist, but the majority of livestock in this country are kept in good and clean environments and ones where they can walk about!
I think I would be fine as a farmer, breeding and buying livestock which ultimately would be slaughtered. But if I personally raised a very few pigs etc I think I would become too fond of them and it would then be impossible to slaughter them.
Last edited by Zapper on Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#18oh thanks for sharing Zap -- you paint such a picture!
Other than cleaning some fish (and somehow I just have difficulty conjuring up the same warm and fuzzy feelings for fish that I might have for bunnies), this recent Thumper-butchering was my first experience with any butchering. I was very curious about how I would respond and whether I would have an emotionally difficult time with it. I am a confirmed carnivore and feel that if we are willing to eat meat, we should be willing to be involved with the process that turns a living creature into meat. But it is one thing to have that as an idea and another thing entirely to go out and kill something.
My friend who raises the rabbits (in her urban backyard, no less) does her best to give the animals a decent life, to slaughter them quickly, and to utilize as much of the animal as is possible. She even dug in deep fencing so that the rabbits have a burrow -- they get fresh air and sunshine, have a burrow, and are fed an organic diet with a wide range of fruits and veg. One of the local organic markets donates its blemished produce to local farmers. When slaughter time comes, the animals are hand-fed, held, and dispatched very very quickly. I was pleased to find that I did not find the process disturbing at all.
I have to admit that my own gender stereotypes got a bit challenged in the process. My friend's husband is a bit too tender-hearted for the butchering which is part of the reason she invited me to take part.
I thought it pretty funny that while the women suited up in raingear, grabbed the sharp knives, and butchered cute little bunnies, the men stayed inside at their computer monitors slaughtering digital creatures. Once we had taken care of all the messy business, the men were willing to package the carcasses for freezing -- but the murder and blood and guts was the women's terrain.
Other than cleaning some fish (and somehow I just have difficulty conjuring up the same warm and fuzzy feelings for fish that I might have for bunnies), this recent Thumper-butchering was my first experience with any butchering. I was very curious about how I would respond and whether I would have an emotionally difficult time with it. I am a confirmed carnivore and feel that if we are willing to eat meat, we should be willing to be involved with the process that turns a living creature into meat. But it is one thing to have that as an idea and another thing entirely to go out and kill something.
My friend who raises the rabbits (in her urban backyard, no less) does her best to give the animals a decent life, to slaughter them quickly, and to utilize as much of the animal as is possible. She even dug in deep fencing so that the rabbits have a burrow -- they get fresh air and sunshine, have a burrow, and are fed an organic diet with a wide range of fruits and veg. One of the local organic markets donates its blemished produce to local farmers. When slaughter time comes, the animals are hand-fed, held, and dispatched very very quickly. I was pleased to find that I did not find the process disturbing at all.
I have to admit that my own gender stereotypes got a bit challenged in the process. My friend's husband is a bit too tender-hearted for the butchering which is part of the reason she invited me to take part.
I thought it pretty funny that while the women suited up in raingear, grabbed the sharp knives, and butchered cute little bunnies, the men stayed inside at their computer monitors slaughtering digital creatures. Once we had taken care of all the messy business, the men were willing to package the carcasses for freezing -- but the murder and blood and guts was the women's terrain.
Proud AvaloNian
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#19I applaud your bunny farming friend Keri for giving her livestock such a good living environment before they end up in pies etc. I think that is the vital part of meat eating, as in we respect the animals that give us food and make sure their living conditions reflect that. I also think it is important that youngsters learn about where meat comes from. I was horrified not long ago to read an article saying that in some of our inner cities children as old as 10 don't know that milk comes from a cow! It is one of life's great ironies to me that in the age of the computer ignorance is rife in the West (illiteracy in the US and UK at all time highs now!).
There are loads of bunnies running around where I live and I prefer looking at them to shooting them. But if I was hungry I would be out there like a caveman! An old neighbour here (sadly died back in 2005), had been a farm worker since the age of 14. When he started work they still used horses to pull small ploughs. During World War II when the UK was on strict food rationing, he told me he would even shoot pigeons so his family didn't go without meat.
Rich lawyers come through from Edinburgh and pay a lot of money to shoot pheasant and deer on the Laird's vast Estate. I can accept that too.....as long as they eat what they kill! To kill a creature for the pleasure of ending its life makes no sense to me at all.
I have my own bunny guilt story....in 2010 my wife's beloved outside office hut was in danger of subsidence due to two rabbits, a young buck and doe, making their home in earnest below it. Like newly weds creating their first home, they worked tirelessly on burrowing, even the small pond near by ended up full of soil! Horrified when she learnt that one buck and doe can produce 25 off-spring in a single year, my wife hired two men and their assortment of Mink to put an end to this problem. They duly turned up and proudly showed us the caged Mink in the back of their large van. Both guys seemed very proud of their Mink and explained how they hand reared them from birth. The Mink seemed equally proud of their human owners, settling on them gently when taken from their cages. Two were chosen for Operation Rabbit Eviction (one named Ronnie and the other Stella). We were informed that Stella was as fast as lightening, quicker than her Mink male counterparts at chasing rabbits out of their burrows. The two guys (both wearing combat style jackets which seemed rather ludicrous considering the Mink were the ones going 'into action'), placed netting around the three rabbit holes at points around the large shed. Ronnie was sent in first (apparently 'still in training'), and like a true amateur he came right back out and refused to go back. So Ronnie was put back inside his cage in the van and Miss Big Guns Stella was sent down. Very quickly a slender rabbit bolted out of one of the holes with such speed that when it entered the net covering the hole, it took right off into the air with it, landing in the freezing pond in front, tangled in netting. One of the guys got it out quickly and pulled the neck of the rabbit with a fast jerk, killing it instantly. It was a doe rabbit.
'Stella is still down there', yelled the other guy, 'She won't come out until she gets the buck!'. We hung about smoking and shivering on what was a freezing January morning. Suddenly a large, fine buck came hurtling out of another hole and into the netting sited over it. It was scooped up and despatched in the same way as its partner and then laid down on the gravel next to her. They looked like they were sleeping except his fur was dry and soft and hers was sodden from the pond water.
The two guys were paid and went on their way along with the rabbits, assuring us that both would not be wasted (but fed to their hunting dogs). To this day I look back on it with a sense of guilt. I noticed this year fresh burrowing under that big shed and I simply smiled and part of me was glad. I don't care if the bloody hut subsides, no way am I going to watch two fine young rabbits die like that again. Am getting soft in my old age.....I think that happens to most of us.
So you see Keri, in the wild it is often the female of the species who is tougher because she has to be! As you will know, it is the lionesses who do the hunting, with a male turning up to grab what he wants and only when he is satiated can the lionesses and cubs feed. Female bears and tigers and so many other female species do not only all the rearing but the hunting too! Strangely only in the bird world does there tend to be mating for life and shared chick rearing (from Swans to Penguins, Eagles to KingFishers).
As to women butchering and not finding blood difficult to cope with, perhaps that is because from an early age, still children really, girls have to cope with menstruation and later child birth. I think there would be far less wars in the world if men had to cope with period pains and bleeding every month plus child birth. Here's to Girl Power!
There are loads of bunnies running around where I live and I prefer looking at them to shooting them. But if I was hungry I would be out there like a caveman! An old neighbour here (sadly died back in 2005), had been a farm worker since the age of 14. When he started work they still used horses to pull small ploughs. During World War II when the UK was on strict food rationing, he told me he would even shoot pigeons so his family didn't go without meat.
Rich lawyers come through from Edinburgh and pay a lot of money to shoot pheasant and deer on the Laird's vast Estate. I can accept that too.....as long as they eat what they kill! To kill a creature for the pleasure of ending its life makes no sense to me at all.
I have my own bunny guilt story....in 2010 my wife's beloved outside office hut was in danger of subsidence due to two rabbits, a young buck and doe, making their home in earnest below it. Like newly weds creating their first home, they worked tirelessly on burrowing, even the small pond near by ended up full of soil! Horrified when she learnt that one buck and doe can produce 25 off-spring in a single year, my wife hired two men and their assortment of Mink to put an end to this problem. They duly turned up and proudly showed us the caged Mink in the back of their large van. Both guys seemed very proud of their Mink and explained how they hand reared them from birth. The Mink seemed equally proud of their human owners, settling on them gently when taken from their cages. Two were chosen for Operation Rabbit Eviction (one named Ronnie and the other Stella). We were informed that Stella was as fast as lightening, quicker than her Mink male counterparts at chasing rabbits out of their burrows. The two guys (both wearing combat style jackets which seemed rather ludicrous considering the Mink were the ones going 'into action'), placed netting around the three rabbit holes at points around the large shed. Ronnie was sent in first (apparently 'still in training'), and like a true amateur he came right back out and refused to go back. So Ronnie was put back inside his cage in the van and Miss Big Guns Stella was sent down. Very quickly a slender rabbit bolted out of one of the holes with such speed that when it entered the net covering the hole, it took right off into the air with it, landing in the freezing pond in front, tangled in netting. One of the guys got it out quickly and pulled the neck of the rabbit with a fast jerk, killing it instantly. It was a doe rabbit.
'Stella is still down there', yelled the other guy, 'She won't come out until she gets the buck!'. We hung about smoking and shivering on what was a freezing January morning. Suddenly a large, fine buck came hurtling out of another hole and into the netting sited over it. It was scooped up and despatched in the same way as its partner and then laid down on the gravel next to her. They looked like they were sleeping except his fur was dry and soft and hers was sodden from the pond water.
The two guys were paid and went on their way along with the rabbits, assuring us that both would not be wasted (but fed to their hunting dogs). To this day I look back on it with a sense of guilt. I noticed this year fresh burrowing under that big shed and I simply smiled and part of me was glad. I don't care if the bloody hut subsides, no way am I going to watch two fine young rabbits die like that again. Am getting soft in my old age.....I think that happens to most of us.
So you see Keri, in the wild it is often the female of the species who is tougher because she has to be! As you will know, it is the lionesses who do the hunting, with a male turning up to grab what he wants and only when he is satiated can the lionesses and cubs feed. Female bears and tigers and so many other female species do not only all the rearing but the hunting too! Strangely only in the bird world does there tend to be mating for life and shared chick rearing (from Swans to Penguins, Eagles to KingFishers).
As to women butchering and not finding blood difficult to cope with, perhaps that is because from an early age, still children really, girls have to cope with menstruation and later child birth. I think there would be far less wars in the world if men had to cope with period pains and bleeding every month plus child birth. Here's to Girl Power!
Re: Bring Back Our Keri Please!!!
#20Whoa the topic is getting intense, all i ever killed to eat was crab and lobster, put in a pot than steamed, also cleaning and cutting up a fish. Handling with rabbits and other animals seem scary, i could never kill a bunny, their so cute.