Celtic Heroes

ok, here is the situation as it stood last:

the vote indicated that is you were part of the fight (lvl 180+ and part of the 5 grps) - you could dice for the drops (by class) - with no level restriction for the 190 drops.

however, this being said, some players said that if we didnt restrict the 190 drops to level 188+ players, they would boycott.

we need to resolve this.

since the vote is that all can dice - here is what i want to know: Who plans to not fight because of this (in protest)? once this is known, we will either:
a. proceed without them
b. fail without them
c. decide to do 188+ dicing for 190 drops and do mordy with them.

thank you

also, if there is some other reason you are conditionally boycotting, it might be nice to know. i think we can cover all the situations with 37 different combinations of the 5 grps depending on who is boycotting.

so, if you will fight for all drops but not if boycotted by highlevels, except if they fight because they get their way or if you will not fight if boycotting high levels decide to fight because they got what they want, or if you want to boycott as a high level in protest of other boycotting high levels who decided to fight after all, or are boycotting because you are high level and are boycotting because of the boycotting low levels boycotting because you got your way - just let me know.

but seriously, lets get this sorted.

I'm just copying my last dicing post to here and will clear other so we stay on topic here.

Well, if we keep the fight at 5 groups max, I dont see an issue with everyone rolling all drops. My 188+ feelings were with more groups there. Like Akbar said, it shouldn't turn into an Aggy fight with 100 ppl. I also believe Mordris can spawn twice a week? As more ppl level it should be possible to do.

I don't understand the logic though, if 170's can roll for crowns and 170's(druids) can roll for 185 hrungnir drops then why is this any different? Because it takes longer to level to 190?

Because I've heard a few people on the forums say that it took them about 15-20 lix per level past 185 depending on good spawns, and those same people said it was about 12-13 lix per level 182-185. Well that shows very little difference between 182-185 and 185-190 in terms of # of lix per level. For my case it only took me 9 elixirs to get 184-185 so I highly doubt it'd take me much longer to get 185-190 compared to the time it took getting 180-185...

But anyway I don't think we should be threatening boycotts, because if 190's disagree and boycott we won't kill it and if the 180's disagree and boycott then you 190's won't be killing it either... Best to just follow what we've been doing all along with all the other bosses right? That's what you've all seemed to be saying on my DPS ring discussion thread.

The percentage of 185 and above is far less than the percentage of 184 and below.
Asking that 188+ dice for 190 drops is NOT prompted by greed, it is prompted by wanting to get us ready for:
1. Easy take down of Mordris
2. Necromancer's defeat.

greed
n.noun
An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth.

It is not greed that prompted the recommendation to have items that can be used now, but the sincere desire to make Mordris (and Necro) easier. After enough ppl get geared, I have no doubt that diceing 190 items would be revisited.

If we look at "fair" how is it "fair" to have a 190 level req drop sit in a bag untill that person levels/trade/sells, or how "fair" is it to have the less than 8% (188+) of server be told that their accomplishment merits nothing, as any 180+ can get a drop that only the 8% can (or can quickly level) to use? What incentive do ppl have to level past 180?
BTW - I am only 185 and therefore would not be eligible to roll for a 190 drop.

It has already been noted that 6 groups is too many. Original plan only calls for 4 groups, Plan was modified to accommodate two additional groups. It has been observed (correctly) that it is just too many.

I fully agree that 5 groups should be the limit. If a level requiremnt of 185 were in place, that would set the high standard that Mordris (and Necro) demand. And also help to soften the picking of group 5.
Many of you have worked hard to get to 185 … Thank you.


DL drops is an entirly different category. Many do a AWESOME job of sharing and helping others … Many do not …. of course what one does with a drop is their business.
As far as lixes per level … so many variables, Attk speed, DPS, Level of Mob …etc, I can tell you from experiance that it takes alot longer for a druid to kill a 180 3 star wyrm than it takes any other class.
As far as 185 and below killing Mordris ….she is up now …. why? If she were that easy and the 185 and below so good she would not be.
Simple fact is we need to work together. We need the high levels to get the DPS where it needs to be to kill her.

Just an abstract observation. Many governments waste money, time and resources because the politition cannot say no.

I kind of feel we are walking backwards here.

First we had a vote on lvl reqs and dicing, and now, after the vote is done, the vote is disregarded and the whole premise for the first vote is drastically changed by the introduction of a limitation to the number of people who are entitled to participate at the mordy battles.

I, for one, would have voted for a lvl 185 req for all but druids if the premise was that only 40 ppl would be allowed to participate in a mordy takedown. This is better than the potential rat race of all 180+ characters who want to join groups 4 and 5 before each battle, a rat race that for sure will generate bad blood.

Secondly, if there was a lvl 185 lvl req for the battle, the question of lvl reqs for 190 drops would be less of an issue and it would be easier to stick to the principle that all legible for fight are also legible for dicing (subject to class, of course).

From what i can understand, the limitation to 5 groups has not been to the vote, and this should imo be the first issue to be resolved, and then both lvl req for joining the fight as well as for dicing 190 drops should be decided in the light of that vote.

There was an intial level 185 requirement for taking place in Mordris. And there was a tremendous uproar and many did not like it, thus the "vote" to include 180-184. We added two additional groups to plan to accomadate the vote. Experiance has now taught (and watching the video) has taught us that too many ppl is not a good thing (flashback to first two Mordris attempts).
We have proven that groups, assigned to a specific job, working together is the way to defeat her, not shear numbers. These groups need to be Maximized for effectiveness, thats why 185 level req was asked on first battle.
The Vote included four things 1. level req of caster 2. level req of DPS 3. dicing req. 4. start of battle.
So, it is nothing personal in my opinion of haveing a level 185 DPS requirement, it is purely a tactical thing.
The number of ppl involved in the battle, from the first publication of the plan, has been designed to be limited. Some thought that we were "excluding" ppl on purpose (and some say for greed reasons). Not the case at all.
Case in point, When the US went and got Osama Bin Laden, there were less than 20 ppl in the assault group that took him down. Granted Many more where indirect support, but actual Boots on ground inside compound very small numbers. This is just IRL example of why small is really better sometimes.

Not everything necessarily needs to be voted on. If the Battle coordinater says 185 requirement than IMHO that should be that. They are looking at the success of the battle.
Please take a look at the video of battle, look at how many toons standing around, granted we did have alot of spectators, but pls look at video.

Looking at Necromancer. The Mordris helms that do not break DL set bonus will play a big part IMHO. The worlds that have first defeated Mordris and have gotten very far with Necro are Dominate Clan servers, The drops go to a clan bank and used and returned to bank as needed. I AM NOT suggesting that we do that, merely pointing out that they use the Mordris drops on Necro.

I completely understand your reasoning Randall, and I agree with you.
The unfortunate thing is that there was a vote for lvl 180 req, and very few argued against lvl 180-184 characters joining.
As I myself expressed under the vote thread, I had felt very close to useless in the Mordy test runs when I was lvl 183/184, but voting for a lvl 185 lvl restriction when i myself had just reached lvl 185 would appear selfish.
many of the high lvl toons even abstained from that part of the vote, even though the discussion now after the 2nd takedown of Mordy demonstrates that there is a consensus among high lvl players that there should be a 185 lvl req.

We'll have to put these first fights (including the votes and disappointments from any expectations generated by these votes) down as educational test fights.

Thx for the video, it was messy with all the spectators, and it could also be that the extra people present put that little extra strain on the server, thus indirectly contributing to lag problems (I also lagged out at a point). All clans should ask non-participating clan members to stay away from the battle.

You're giving Osama Bin Laden way too much credit, by the way. I like Mordy better;-)

There was no argument against 180's joining because we all hoped that adding more groups would be easier. It wasnt and we also had some new faces join this fight and see first hand how difficult it was. The vote was disregarded because a lot of people didnt bother to vote. Some of them were key people who decided to voice their opinions in-game instead.

So far, unless youre a mage, doesnt seem that the vote even matters yet. (Lucky mages)

Mordris should spawn twice a week and if everyone thinks theyre equal and that 190's are just being greedy elitists, then she should die twice every week. No?

I have players in my clan trying to get to 190 now and its proving difficult. They see the need for higher levels and are also interested in the Necro. Thats motivation enough for them. I still feel 188+ for 190 drops isnt too much to ask since most of us are the ones Alting and Rebirthing too. Somewhere in this server, a huge sense of entitlement was given to players and many people feel that they deserve stuff just for being there. There doesn't seem to be any desire to 'earn' items anymore because theres always high levels around to do the work. Without Callator, Callumallen, or Elle, Snorri 6 isnt easy. The same high levels tank all of the bosses and are always called to tank them all. Then when the fight is over they are treated as equals with some people who barely auto-attack.

Sorry for the rant but I see the frustration first hand from the 190's as I am one of them. Its like going to work and doing nothing but expecting the same paycheck as your boss. Well, I showed up. Wheres my check?

I still agree that if we do 185+ and 5 groups then everyone can dice. Its more on the fair side and would cause less grief even tho some people wont get much further than 185.

Im cool with that;-)

Im also comfortable with the principle of one designated battle coordinator who calls the shots, also regarding lvl req, number of groups and dicing rules for that one fight.

just a thought...

what if all present are made eligible to dice but then have the person ready to use drop borrow the drop.

this way, the goal of having mordy killed faster and more efficiently is still achieved since the drops dont end up gathering web in a bank. but then also the person who won the drop gets to push himself to level to be able to use said drop he rightful won. this makes us adhere to the current rules the server has in place.

as far as leveling, as long as u set u mind to wanting to do it it is achievable. whether u solo, in a group, get ksed, lagged or whatever...u just got to want it...

just a thought...